Glamis Curfew

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How do you feel about the present Comp Hill curfew?

Yes, I feel the curfew is necessary, leave it as it is
17
22%
Yes, I feel the curfew is necessary for now, but it should end soon
14
18%
No, There is no reason for the curfew
46
60%
 
Total votes: 77

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Glamis Curfew

Post by Sand Commander »

How do you feel about the current Comp Hill curfew?
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Post by Dusty Rhodes »

Pardon my ignorance, but before I vote, what is the curfew for Comp Hill right now?
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Post by Wolfpack »

I'm bummed that it was instituted, but can understand why. I'd like to see it llifted but I suspect that when\if it is that it would in short order revert right back to what it was at it's worst. I'd like to hope that it wouldn't - but stupid is as stupid does. Knuckleheads always seem to wreck it for everyone else.
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Post by Washroad »

Dusty Rhodes wrote:Pardon my ignorance, but before I vote, what is the curfew for Comp Hill right now?
Most "holiday" weekend nights from dusk to dawn.


Personally, I don't ride at night (sorry Ron! Hey! When you comin' over to take me on a night ride????? :lol: :lol: :lol: ) so hill closures don't have an effect on me.

Some of my group does night ride and they have had to leave Olds. I think people ought to be allowed to play at Glamis whenever they want to.

I can't see closing the hills, but if the BLM/ICSO did their jobs properly and chased out/ticketed/arrested the trouble makers when it happens it wouldn't be a problem. Get a 4WD paddy wagon and just load it up. Patrol the crowd more often. Just my $.02.
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Post by OBSESSED »

Comp Hill as I remember it...

Was closed by Wally Lindemburger [ICBOS] supervisor... What, 5 or 6 years ago?
It was all along to be only a Temp fix of the "Comp Hill Issues"
The closure was never meant to be for ever.

History:
Comp Hill was the meeting place for many duners for the place to go at night. "Night Hill" as some called it. However, with the rise of drug use, and the fear of the LEO's to moderate the crowd's, it was the easy and lazy way out to close the area.
It is a closure, not a curfew. Comp Hill is closed on the six major weekends, from dusk to dawn. You may dune through the area formally know as the Comp Hill Pit, however, you can not stop.

The party has moved to Olds Hill. BFD, nothing was stopped by the ICBOS action [the closure of Comp]. The closure has been a boondoggle, and a great snafu, for the ICBOS. However they have the power, so at least, they left the rest of the Hills open. What has helped with lower crime in the areas, is the family friendly atmosphere. The druggies still dune Glamis, it is they also understand Zero tolerance.

Now fast forward to 2007. The Olds Hill pit is starting to look and feel like the Comp Pit. Wood fragments, broken melted bottles, nails, what ever an idiot can throw into a fire, he/she will do it. 2001, the end of an era, the Closure of Comp Hill at night on the 6 major holiday weekends [Halloween, Turkey Day, New Years, MLK Day, Presidents Day, Easter-I think were the days]…
The ICBOS should be held accountable for anyone injured by debris left behind at Olds. In the Old days, you could very easily avoid Comp Hill [Night Hill], and go to Olds Hill [Day Hill] and stay away from the junk from the previous nights party at Comp. Now, all the day and night crap is all left in one spot: Oldsmobile Hill.

My reaction to Bill’s poll:
IT IS TOO LATE…

My Opinion:
The damage is done. Habits are formed. Even if Comp is Re-Opened, and the ‘curfew’ is lifted, it does not matter now! The only people who will dune Comp at Night now, will be those duners who quit duning at Y2K and start up after the re-opening of Comp. All the newbies will still dune at Olds… Unless, they curfew Olds Hill at night on the 6 major holiday weekends! Pinch points worked at Comp, they [ICBOS] said they didn’t, however, that is a lie that has been repeated over and over and now many believe it. I set out to monitor the Comp Hill going on’s when Wally and his merry Supervisors set out to disrupt the duner life style. Pinch points worked fine, and not only that, they sent a message to the curious drivers [on Sand Highway, and Hwy 78] that there was a huge [LEO] presence at Glamis. No one complained [much] about being asked for DL, etc at the pinch points. Pallets could have also been stopped. The thing, the “Pinch Points” were proactive, and the ICBOS and most of the LEO’s are reactive. Plus, the man power [LEO overtime] it took men to man the points. It cost too much, the pinch points don‘t work, let‘s just close Comp [these lie’s were told to us by the ICBOS over and over-They were also told to me by Wally right before the first closure of Comp] . The ICBOS, reacted and now they might act again. Too Late baby…. It’s too late.
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Post by MR. PETE »

Obsessed wrote:
My reaction to Bill’s poll:
IT IS TOO LATE…
I think so too.

I am not much of a night time duner now, but in the 90's I used to enjoy taking newbies and the young kids on their quads over to Comp at night. It was easy to get to and the kids would get in a "night ride." Once we got there we would stay for a short time and head back.

Sometimes if preferred, we would take the "Primary Vehicle" there on Hwy 78 to watch from above.

The newbies were always impressed by the roar of engines reverberating from the valley below. We did not stay long, but just long enough to say we had been there.

Sure there were people who caused some trouble and left trash, but I never thought that the crowds were unusually rowdy. Seems most were just hanging out and having a good time.

Too bad that opportunity is gone.

However, if the curfew is ever lifted at Comp, Olds will still be a go-to spot for many unless there is an enforced night time curfew (closure).

Realistically, I do not think that the LEO's will want to or can afford to patrol two places.

I suspect that the next item on the agenda will be to night "curfew" Olds as well. Then the troublemaking crowd will move to another place...
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Post by L&L Corvairs »

Amazingly, I agree with most of what Obsessed said. <note to self, check meds>

There is no such thing as a ‘curfew’. It’s a closure, IMO. There was no need to close it back then and no need to keep it that way now. I disagree with Obsessed and Mr. Pete on what will happen if the closure is lifted. I think the party will move back to Comp. Where it belongs. It’s much easier to drive the 2wd vehicles full of booze, wood and partiers down to the Comp. Pit then Olds Hill.

The ICSO and ICBOS created this problem of having to possibly patrol two places at night. They should work up a solution to fix it that doesn’t take our riding land away. Personally, I agree with Obsessed on the pinch points and increased LEO presence in the crowd.

Finally, it’s NEVER too late to get back some riding area that is closed, even if it’s only for a few more hours a weekend.
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Post by Sandcock »

but if the BLM/ICSO did their jobs properly and chased out/ticketed/arrested the trouble makers when it happens it wouldn't be a problem
Knuckleheads always seem to wreck it for everyone else
The penalty needs to be stiff enough where it really gets the attention of the knuckleheads.
The public lands provide significant economic benefits to the Nation and to states and counties where these lands are located. Revenues generated from public lands make BLM one of the top revenue-generating agencies in the Federal government. In 2007, for instance, BLM’s onshore mineral leasing activities will generate an estimated $4.5 billion in receipts from royalties, bonuses, and rentals that are collected by the Minerals Management Service. Approximately half of these revenues will be returned to the States where the mineral leasing occurred.

The Bureau administers about 57 million acres of commercial forests and woodlands through the Management of Lands and Resources and the Oregon and California Grant Lands appropriations. Timber receipts (including salvage) are estimated to be $55.4 million in fiscal year 2007, compared to estimated receipts of $33 million in Fiscal Year 2006 and actual receipts of $13.5 million in Fiscal Year 2005.


Looks like BLM has plenty of dinero :roll: Why don't they channel funds to clean up Comp, Olds, and along Gecko :?: It seems to be the MO for the Gov to do this on a regular basis. BTW, what does BLM do with the other half of the $4.5 billion collected by the Mineral Management Service :?:
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What about the hard working folk in congessted SoCal that need to get away and recreate for a weekend :-k

I say clean it up, open it, provide the necesary law enforcement, and LETS RIDE :D

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Post by Intelliduner »

OBSESSED wrote: The Olds Hill pit is starting to look and feel like the Comp Pit. Wood fragments, broken melted bottles, nails, what ever an idiot can throw into a fire, he/she will do it.
True. We were shocked to see all the crap at the base of Olds a couple weeks ago. Sad. We need to find a good hill that pickup trucks, Rhinos, and other party-wagons cannot make it to, and christen a new night hill.

_d

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Post by Voice »

The Comp Hill closure and the defacto curfew at Olds (enforced with S.W.A.T. tactics) are just another example of the BLM showing that they really have no clue about what they are doing out there.
And for the record, before it gets lost in time, let us not forget that there was some very damning evidence showing that the BLM was very much in favor of having the Board (Wally) enact this Comp closure and it was even accused (with some corrobating evidence) that the BLM actually put the IV board up to it because the BLM's hands were tied in the matter.
Put into English that means that the FEDERAL BLM encouraged the LOCAL IV board to enact a LOCAL law which dramatically changed the usage of FEDERAL land and that the BLM encouraged this because they were unable to opperate under their own guidelines.

There have been several attempts to get the board to pull their heads out and recend this punitive rule and the IV board has so far been completely unresponsive.
Maybe the BLM is telling them to ignore us? Who knows?
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Post by Sand Commander »

Over 200 people looked at this poll. 28 voted.

WHAT IS THE MATTER WITH YOU?
DON"T YOU HAVE AN OPINION?
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Post by Woodglue »

Sand Commander wrote:Over 200 people looked at this poll. 28 voted.

WHAT IS THE MATTER WITH YOU?
DON"T YOU HAVE AN OPINION?
:shock:


I would bet my next paycheck that 'over 200' people haven’t logged on to this board since 11:54am two days ago. Fact remains, each time you pop your head in to view results of your own poll, you are being tallied as another 'view'. :wink:
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Post by NE14SAND »

i believe it was to the point that something HAD to be done. i also believe if it was opened now it would be easier to control. i also believe LOTS have changed since then, IN A GOOD WAY. the closeing of comp is destroying olds. the locals will ALWAYS party in the sand on fri and sat night, give them back comp (heavy leo presance) so we can be left alone at olds. i have only been around the sand for 7 seasons and spent allmost all of it at the loop, i have seen LOTS of GOOD changes. lets be real here as long as US the duners police things as well i dont see the old copm days ever commin back (a good thing) there ya go, thats my oppinion
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Post by airkuld »

Sand Commander wrote:Over 200 people looked at this poll. 28 voted.

WHAT IS THE MATTER WITH YOU?
DON"T YOU HAVE AN OPINION?
Eh, it's been debated before, bottom line is nothing's ever going to open it back up, and if it does by some miracle, all the old problems would show right back up. It's not the cops fault, it's the yahoo's that screw it up for the rest of us. As for "keep out the troublemakers", well 1. nobody's a "troublemaker" until after the fact, no matter what their hat looks like and 2. they are keeping out the troublemakers right now, at the expense of the rest of us.

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Post by OBSESSED »

airkuld wrote:
Sand Commander wrote:Over 200 people looked at this poll. 28 voted.

WHAT IS THE MATTER WITH YOU?
DON"T YOU HAVE AN OPINION?
Eh, it's been debated before, bottom line is nothing's ever going to open it back up, and if it does by some miracle, all the old problems would show right back up. It's not the cops fault, it's the yahoo's that screw it up for the rest of us. As for "keep out the troublemakers", well 1. nobody's a "troublemaker" until after the fact, no matter what their hat looks like and 2. they are keeping out the troublemakers right now, at the expense of the rest of us.
#1-I 100% agree with you...
#2-I have view this poll about 200 times so the actual number of 'different' viewers is a little low.
#3-Have a good day unless you want to have a %&($*& day than have one of those...

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Post by HozayKwarvo »

Sand Commander wrote:Over 200 people looked at this poll. 28 voted.

WHAT IS THE MATTER WITH YOU?
DON"T YOU HAVE AN OPINION?
I do 8)

I sit on the TRT Public Safety Sub-committee, formerly known as the "Competition Hill Solutions Team (part 2)".

I voted: No, There is no reason for the curfew

I too see it as a closure, not a curfew.
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Post by Mike330R »

Voted no as well.

Is the ASA taking input from dune users? if so-NICE!
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Post by L&L Corvairs »

Mike330R wrote:Voted no as well.

Is the ASA taking input from dune users? if so-NICE!

YEAH!!! They've managed to get 52 of 'em since June 4th.

Kinda sad really.
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Post by Mike330R »

But that's 100% of this BBS's readers :)
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Post by Woodglue »

Mike330R wrote:But that's 100% of this BBS's readers :)
Is that what you came here for MIKE, to post like that!?
Your vote has been noted, now TAKE OFF!
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Post by Sloppyduner »

NE1 brought up the locals. As I remember that was a big part of the problem. Locals who just went to comp to party. My memory is a bit fuzzy here. Were the passes instituted back when “the curfew” was put in to place? Another thing I’m unsure of, because I don’t spend a lot of time at Olds, are there as many locals at Olds then there were at Comp? Do they check passes in trucks at Olds? Basically what I’m wondering is have passes been able to help keep out the locals?

Not that the locals were the only people who caused problems.


btw I voted :wink:
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Post by L&L Corvairs »

The Demo Fee/passes went in before the Comp Hill closure.

From my observations, the party crowd simply moved to Olds, as most of us predicted when ICBOS came up with the Comp Hill deal in the first place.
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Post by Mike330R »

Woodglue wrote:
Mike330R wrote:But that's 100% of this BBS's readers :)
Is that what you came here for MIKE, to post like that!?
Your vote has been noted, now TAKE OFF!
I came to be informed and inform if I am able.
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Post by Washroad »

Mike330R wrote:
Woodglue wrote:
Mike330R wrote:But that's 100% of this BBS's readers :)
Is that what you came here for MIKE, to post like that!?
Your vote has been noted, now TAKE OFF!
I came to be informed and inform if I am able.
I choose not to believe you.
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Post by crash »

Do I sense some hostilities here???

Maybe I shouldn't even ask, but it is slow, and I AM in need of some entertainment. :D

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Post by Sandcock »

your :twisted: crash :lol:
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Post by Mike330R »

You know you missed me.

I keep coming here looking for the post "stakes removed due to ASA due diligence"
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Post by Washroad »

Mike330R wrote:You know you missed me.

I keep coming here looking for the post "stakes removed due to ASA due diligence"
Ahh, Mike.....

Missed you? No. Wouldn't even know it if you were gone forever.

I've never seen you inform anyone here of anything, ever.

Hmmm, it's funny, also, you keep throwing up those lame little straw-man arguments almost like you expect someone to bite. Jeez, if I had a horse that lame I'd shoot it.
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Post by Mike330R »

Aim it at your foot then.
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Post by crash »

\:D/ :-^

Where's the popcorn eating emoticon? :D

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Post by Washroad »

crash wrote:\:D/ :-^

Where's the popcorn eating emoticon? :D
:lol: :lol: :lol: We need one for these cases, don't we? :lol: :lol: :lol:

It sucks to be some people.
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Post by Mike330R »

Agreed!

Glad I am me and you are you.
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Post by Washroad »

Hey mike,

Do you think that anything you have done will get the stakes removed???

Just thought I'd ask.

I know you're doing a lot.....
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Post by Mike330R »

That straw-man argument is old as well.

But I'll bite: No, nothing I have done will get the stakes removed.

Your turn-What have you done to remove the stakes?
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Post by Washroad »

Mike330R wrote:That straw-man argument is old as well.

But I'll bite: No, nothing I have done will get the stakes removed.

Your turn-What have you done to remove the stakes?
It wasn't a strawman argument, it was a direct question.

I raise money for the ASA to continue the fight.

I'm part of the ASA Endowment Committee.

I'm in on a lot of the BOD meetings/phone calls.

I have hand-delivered plaques/letters of appreciation to Business Sponsors.

I sign up new members.

I'm a Supporting Member of the ASA and have been for several years.

Ask any member of the ASA BOD; when I'm asked to do a task and I accept it, it gets done and on time.

Anything I do on behalf of the ASA is an attempt to get the stakes removed.


The thing is Mr. Lyon, I know full well you hate the ASA. I think everyone that reads this board knows that. I'm OK with that. I just gotta wonder (honestly) why you come on this board? Whenever you post here it's an attempt to deride the ASA.

No, you don't ask "hard" questions and it's very transparent what you attempt to do.
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Post by Sloppyduner »

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....and at the end of that light there is another tunnel

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Post by Sandcock »

Sloppy, is the new avatar your new look :wink:
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Post by Mike330R »

Your the man washroad. Keep up the hard work!
Mike

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Post by crash »

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Thanks Slop. :wink:

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Post by Sloppyduner »

Scoot over crash. I'm just gonna watch this one.
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Post by norocksplease »

was necessary, no more.
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Post by CrstyDmn »

No need for it now.
The result it achieved is now a clear message.

High fines and inprisonment for laws not obeyed.

I say we get it back.

Or was it really not intended to be "Temp" as stated?

:roll:
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Post by crash »

HUH :?: :?:

Oh, yea, the topic.....whatever.

I want to hear more from 330 and Washroad. :twisted:

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Post by Washroad »

CrstyDmn wrote:No need for it now.
The result it achieved is now a clear message.

High fines and inprisonment for laws not obeyed.

I say we get it back.

Or was it really not intended to be "Temp" as stated?

:roll:
I don't really know if it was supposed to be "tempory" or just a holiday thing like it is.
Brian
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"Facts don't enter a world dominated by our beliefs." Proust
The whole "point" of life is that there is no "point." There's just life.
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Post by SailAway »

CrstyDmn wrote: Or was it really not intended to be "Temp" as stated?
There is a well known and (too) often used saying about that...

"There is nothing so permanent as a temporary government closure."

VW
Vicki Warren
President of DUNERS and Friends of
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http://www.FriendsOfDumontDunes.org

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Post by CrstyDmn »

That was my point VW....

"Temp" seems to become the way it is.

Non-Holiday weekends Comp Hill was still closed.
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Post by Woodglue »

CrstyDmn wrote:Non-Holiday weekends Comp Hill was still closed.
:shock: Which weekends?
I think it's something like 12 weekends a year, not all of them are holidays IIRC. But still, have you seen comp closed on an unscheduled weekend?
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Post by Doc »

Here is the press release for the original Comp hill curfew. It is supposed only to be in effect of holiday weekends.

BLM Press Release



If anyone has information that it is occurring on other than holiday weekends please let me know and the TRT will bring this up with the BLM and ICSO.

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Post by Voice »

I have only two questions concerning this policy.

How in the world did the County gain the power to shut down FEDERAL land on THEIR whim?

and,

Why in the world would the BLM let them?


I suppose those are rhetorical questions.
Mahmoud Ahmedinejad in a letter to President Elect Barak Obama
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Post by crash »

I believe authority and jurisdictions are commonly shared between agencies when there are agreements in place. GW?

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